Insurance, Pemits & Licenses

[Rick Shipley]

Hello there everyone,

I saw it mentioned in another post that the producer is in charge of permits and licenses as well as insurance (I put that in there). I wanted to touch on this subject for just a second.

Since Colorado isn't Califonia, is there much casue for obtaining permits and licenses for low budget productions in this state?

My personal experiences in Baltimore and Las Vegas, folks didn't give much hastle about having permits and licenses to shoot. As long as you weren't trying to disrupt traffic, shut down sidewalks and such, nobody questioned you about having permits and licenses for a low budget production. Don't get me wrong, if you have a crew of 15 people or more, a bunch or lights burning up the darkness and loud noises like gunfire booming, I'm sure the police would like to see your permits and licenses for shooting that night. BUT if you have something as minor as, a 5 person crew, 20 mins of shooting time of someone walking into a building or a minor dialogue scene outdoors, I don't think that many people (including the police) take notice.

On the same not about permits and licenses, does anyone know how easy are they to obtain in this state and what is the cost?

I would also like to ask if anyone carries insurance on their productions here?

If so, is there anyone local that handles this and what is the current rate in this state?

Thanks,
Rick

[Jim Brennan]

Great question Rick. I know there are people with more experience in these areas than I have, but I will fill in the blanks where I can.

I think that the spectrum runs from the professional to the irresponsible, with most local filmmakers falling somewhere in between.

You are right that most of the time people won't notice or care if you are shooting for a few minutes in a public place. I have done that many times without a permit. If you are shooting in a private home or business (with the written permission of the property owner), you are even less likely to get hassled. But at the same time, it's always best to do your due diligence. Call the locality you are planning to shoot in. You don't have to give them your name, but just tell them briefly what you want to do and ask about permits. Some places don't require them, except under the circumstances you described above (traffic, etc) Other places may require them, but they are either free or at little cost (although they often can require proof of insurance.) Although the odds of getting hassled are small, if it's just a little legwork to get the paperwork in order it's worth it. Not only will it help you out in case you do get questioned, it's part of the process that will become more important as your productions grow, so you might as well learn how it works. You will find many localities to be downright enthusiastic to help. There are advantages to living here, and a bureaucracy that is largely un-jaded about filmmakers is one of them.

One thing that I cannot stress enough is that if you are going to shoot anything that involves simulated violence, or where there are firearms visible (even if they are not being fired), you should let the local police know. Nothing stops a production like the SWAT team showing up because somebody happened to see a gun in the distance or while passing by a location. I know Colorado had an incident like that a few summers ago in the mountains, where everyone was okay. But I also know that last year the same thing happened abroad and a few people were killed when cops mistook actors for criminals. Depending on the shoot and where it's at, it can be a good idea to pay for a cop to babysit your set in these cases. That solves a lot of problems, and many cities will do that for a small fee.

Insurance is a different animal There are 2 that are (IMHO) pretty important and should be looked at in all but possibly the tiniest of shoots.

Liability This one will help you out if something bad happens. A light falls on someone's head, Your lead actor slips and falls. Stuff like that. I know there are filmmakers in town that have gotten million plus dollar policies for liability for well under a thousand dollars for the year. Call your insurance agent and ask them. Or just call some insurance companies. I think that State Farm and Nationwide offer it, and I am pretty sure that The Hartford has a special plan specifically for film. It's worth the money. Imagine how you would feel if someone got seriously hurt on your set, through no fault of their own. They wind up ot of work, or in need of serious medical care. It would be nice if a) you could help out with that, and b)when they sue you that your insurance covers the damages so you don't have to lose your house.

Worker's Comp Technically, if you are an employer, you should have this. I think we all know what it is and what it does. Call around and ask for rates. If you are running a larger production and have a payroll service like PayReels (a local company that is full of really nice people, and worth looking into) will do those deductions from your actors paycheck.

Of course, if you have gear, you probably want that covered, and at that point you can start looking around for packages that cover all of the above.

To me, this is as much a part of the process as learning how to set up a shot or direct actors (unless you have a partner that you can trust who will do this part for you, or you just hire on to other people's shoots).

Hopefully someone else can chime in with specific experiences

[Darlene Cypser]

Actually the cheapest and easiest way to take care of the worker's comp is to go directly to Pinnacle Assurance which controls the Workers Comp funds in Colorado. If you make if very clear that you are talking about short term, temp, part-time employees you should be able to get it down near the minimum. For Highwayman we are paying about $275 per year for the Workers Comp.

[Jim Brennan]

Good tip Darlene. Thanks again for bringing the voice of experience.

[Coloradosploitation Films]

It depends on what you're trying to do and how much money you've got. To get a permit in Colorado you have to have insurance, and to get insurance you have to have quite a bit of money. If you're shooting a twenty-thousand dollar movie, then don't even bother trying.
However...there are ways of getting around this.
A-nobody cares if you're shooting dialogue scenes at the park or on 16th street mall....but no one will care if homeless Joe keeps ruining your takes by offering you a rather lewd exchange for crack. So long as your shooting in the day and not setting up lighting rigs or blocking the sidewalk, then you might not end up on the business end of the often used nightsticks of the DPD.

B- Don't try shooting in front of the Mint, the bank, or any government building. They assume your making your video so you can plan your robbery....and will treat you accordingly [see also: nightsticks] Shoot your third-base make out scene in front of Gary's Pawn shop...just make sure you get Gary's permision. Most businesses will let you film in front of their place, or in their parking lot, just so long as it doesn't bother the customers.

C-Don't be an idiot. Don't shoot your 'massacre of ten year olds' scene in the middle of the street. Even your quiet residential areas. Someone will call the cops, and at best you'll be given a very stern talking to while in handcuffs. You may also be beaten and thrown in jail. Jim was right, a few summers ago a few retards decided to shoot a scene on public property where a girl was bound and abused by a screaming man with a gun. Believe it or not they were nearly all gunned down by the DPD.

D-Keep in on private property.....and be quiet! If you need to shoot a screaming and yelling scene, make sure you go door to door on the block and introduce yourself, your film, and tell the neighbors that you're shooting a scene, not really beating your wife [this trick also works very well when you really beat your wife.]

E- keep on a college campus....you wouldn't believe how many good locations are on a college campus. Just make sure you're wearing a hat or shirt for that school, then shoot away. If the campus police bother you, just point to your hat/shirt and say 'I'm a student, and didn't know any better. Sorry.' I've done this more times than i can count. If all else fails, point to a PA and tell the police officer that he's the producer. When they draw their nightsticks and descend upon him, run for it.

Now on to insurance- Once again, for the small film, this is a sticky situation. Things and people can get hurt if you're shooting action scenes. But how can you afford insurance if you can barely afford cyborg guard costumes for you masterpiece: 'The Erotic Adventures of timetraveling Bob Dole'?
Here's a bit of advice: be extra careful. This may sound overly simple, but it's true. Make damn sure no one is within fifty feet of the doll house filled with M-80s to shoot the scene when you bomb the vatican. Make sure if someone has to jump off the roof, that it's not your actors. Heck, do it yourself. I'll often do the stuntwork myself...you must suffer for art! I also, being a rather limited actor. Will play whatever male role takes the most physical chances. If you can get away with it, throw a dummy off the roof!

Just remember the three rules of moviemaking as set down by Troma President, Lloyd Kaufman

1-Safety to people
2-Safetey to property
3-Make a good movie

[Danny Diaz]

I think everyone covered your questions, if you need insurance you can go to Matt Travis, at Cherry Creek Insurance, 303 799 0110.

You need at the minimum general liability insurance and that is if you want to bring the production into a building like the courthouse, Union Station, or High School. It costs around 400 to 800 per shoot, spanning the weekend or a few days. This is strange because you can get it for the year for around 350. So I recommend that, I carry general lIability. The only thing it doesn't cover are stunts, animals, and pornography.

Next is equipment cover - most rental houses will add on 10% for stuff like camera or whatever, but you can get yearly cover as well and this is important if you want to rent lens and such. 25,000 in coverage will run you around 1000 dollars. once you have this policy in place you can fax it over to film video and they will deduct the insurance fees they charge and that will save you a little money. For example on HD Panasonic camera it rents for 700 a day but with insurance from them it runs like 850 or 900. so you save 100 or so dollars. Plus you usually can insure up to 10,000 dollars of your personal equipment which is nice.

And usually you can pay it off through out the year in full, or quarter payments even eighths if needed

[Rick Shipley]

Great answers guys.

I'm not a big fan of insurance because it is almost always a waste of money that could be put to better use. I have avoided paying insurance for most things by having everyone sign a liability waiver up front. To be clear though, I never ask anyone to do anything that is considered dangerous or harmful, that's what stunt people are for and they pay their own insurance.

As far as lights falling on someone's head, how many times have you seen that? The closest that I have ever seen to that was when I we were getting ready to shoot one night and a guy didn't set the parking break in his own truck and it drifted back back and hit a trailer in a parking lot (it was a pull along trailer and the truck made a dent on the corner of it about the size of a quarter). If an actor trips and falls down, I say, "you have to pick em' up before you put em' down." And once they pick themselves up and they aren't seriously hurt, either they laugh or everyone around them with laugh at them. I do get your point though, anything can happen. But then again, that is why I always like to have a trained first aid tech on site every time we shoot, just in case. Let's face it, you could be hurt worse in your own house than on a set where people are looking out for everyone's safety. There is more of a chance of a camera getting broken than someone loosing a drop of blood or even getting a bruise. I'll wager to say that there are more screenwriters are in danger of getting paper cuts than someone getting seriously hurt on a set. With that in mind, I wonder if all writers should get health insurance for just such a thing? Then again, with the information from Danny about insurance premiums being $350 a year, I would consider that in a heartbeat just to be on the safe side.

That is funny that some guys got into a little trouble with the law for being stupid. Then again I've been in this situation before. Some yahoo called the cops on us once when we were shooing a gun fight scene. Imagine a bunch of white boys in a black area of Baltimore City with a bunch of guns, no wonder they called the cops. The must've thought the white boys were taking over or putting together a meth lab (there the call it crack). When the Police showed up (5 cars), they didn't come out with guns drawn or anything. They had already noticed the lights, reflectors, a 5 person crew with slate boards, clipboards, scripts, a camera on a tripod and me behind the camera they just said, "Oh, ya'll are shootin' a movie." We said, "yep" and they asked if any of the guns were real, when they saw they were airsoft guns, they got in their cars and left. We had written permission to be there and that was that, they never bothered us for the rest of the week we shot there. Since we weren't loud and the guns made no sounds, no one else said a word. After that, we had our cast member that was a Baltimore County NARC hang out when we were shooing anything else with guns out doors and the best part was that we didn't want to get paid to be there for "Police Relations."

On the other note, I think the ONLY times any productions that I've worked on had permits were when they were multi-million dollar productions. I was curious about the permit situation because I know there are some scenes that I would like to shoot in places where it might be helpful. My main goal in asking is because I've had people have second thoughts the day we show up to shoot and deny us permission. With location agreements and a permit to shoot on the location, we would have every right to be there and it is harder to deny us or to be run off. That almost happened to us in Vegas once.

To me, I think your statement "There are advantages to living here, and a bureaucracy that is largely un-jaded about filmmakers is one of them" is actually (in my eyes) a disadvantage. When folks don't have any idea what goes on during a shoot, it tends to be more of a problem. They don't understand why it takes as long as it does, they take up a bunch of time asking a list of questions and even though some folks mean well, they end up causing more problems than anything. When they aren't exposed to or around folks that even do it on an zero budget level they tend to be a pest, but that is only my opinion. Also when folks have no idea about what goes on, they assume that you have big bags of money and will pay big bucks for them to be in the background. That and fact that the cops don't know the difference between a movie shoot and real events ("I shot him because I thought he was a real vampire Sarge.")

Jim you have some great information here and I'm poking a little fun, I hope you don't take it the wrong way.

Danny, I like what you have to say bro, keep jumping in!

Also, Thank you Nick for your colorfully funny yet true words of advice. You are 100% right. I have to say that I've got to work with you soon.

Rick

[elizabeth rivera]

Hi, my Elizabeth Rivera, I am a writer/director/producer and performer,
it funny you ask about colorado rules and regulations
aIout filming because I need to know about califorina's
regulations please let me know.
Thanks Elizabeth AKA Lezzett

[Maria Teresa Garcia]

CO differs incredible from CA. I went to film school in CA and shot 7 short films throughout LA and Ventura County. Permits are NEEDED in CA. You gotta do your due dilligence to a 'T' out there. Which means contact the local film offices/look at websites. Usually a $1mil limit for insurance, expecially public locations. Luckily, my school provided the insurance. I didn't get stopped or ask for my paperwork, but out there it's more likely as they see productions all the time and know what they need to look for (most of the time).

Then I came to CO and shot a short. Out here, it is VERY lax. Coming from a CA filming mindset I still needed the comfort of making sure we had all areas covered. I even had them draw me up letters/permits for the private residences. haha. That's me though. Just make sure you know what's going on, and are prepared as well as you can be. The more you finish in pre-pro and cover your basis the better you'll be. But in CO from what I found during that shoot in 2008, you only need permits for public areas. Private residences are free game, just for your own peace of mind get them to sign an agreement.

WAIT - I gotta retrack about it being more likely to get asked for paperwork in CA vs CO. Because I never got stopped for paperwork in CA, but here in CO - in Boulder the route up baseline (we shot our opening sequence in those hills), I was STOPPED. haha. We were two hours from wrapping for the day, and a park ranger guy pulls up by the vehicles and asks what's going on?? I end up having to whip out my permit binder for the location. He saw it, we talked some and he continued on his way. haha. It was nearing our last day of filming too. If not the last day. haha. Can't believe I almost forgot about that. Although he didn't specifically ask to see the permit, he just wanted to know if we had paperwork or permission to be up there - he didn't really know what to ask for. So, in this case whipping out a binder full of permits for our locations kinda shut him up and made him friendlier in a pinch. :)

[Nicholas H. Schmid]

I have a question regarding insurance, as well. As an up-and-coming wanna-be producer, I'm still trying to learn my way around the red tape. I would love to secure some nice locations, which I will obviously need Public Liability and Property Damage insurance for.

Am I able to get those if I don't have an established business? I just want to be able to provide location managers with something the next time I try to throw together a film just for kicks, but I don't have the means to start up a business yet.

I'm going to call around to a few insurance places and find out what I can do, but if anyone has any advice for me (what I've read in this discussion so far has been a tremendous help) your advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you all, and happy filming!

[Jim Brennan]

I believe you can get general liability insurance as an individual. Best thing to do is call an agent.

As far as the means to start a business, all you need to do to start is register a trade name with the Department of Revenue (or that might have changed to the Secretary of State's office...) It costs around 20 dollars. Then you can open a bank account under your business name. You will be a sole proprietorship, which means you are your business. There are other entities to look into (like LLC's, C-corporations, S-corporations,,etc), which can have some advantages. It also can be a good idea to create a separate entity for specific projects. If you are generating revenue and expenses, you need to keep track of all of that, and eventually pay taxes, FICA, etc. But start with registering your trade name. The state of Colorado's web site is a good place to start.

[Darlene Cypser]

You can not register a tradename under the Colorado Dept of Revenue. All tradenames have been moved to the Colorado Secretary of State's office. It also makes a lot more sense to just create a Limited Liability Company in the name you want for you business. That costs $50. It is a fill-in-the-blank form online at the Secretary of State's website. If you are the sole owner then you don't have to file separate tax returns for the business, only add a Schedule C or C-EZ to your own 1040 tax return. Many bansk have inexpensive bank accounts for small businesses. Getting insurance is another issue. Many agents don't seem to know what they are doing and issue quotes for the wrong types of policies. Some people are insured for too much and some not really insured for what they are doing.

If you are only making a short and need insurance for a short period of time I can refer your a website of an agent who can get you insurance fast for a couple hundred dollars.

[Darlene Cypser]

If you need general liability insurance for a few days to cover a location, these people can get it for you fast: www.ChaseAgency.com If you are producing on a regular basis then an annual policy would be better. When I find a decent agent for that I will let you know.